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Using The Word "gay"
Zack de la Rocha Network Forum > the 'burbs > .:: Best and Worst... ::. > .:: "the hot seat" ::.
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cosmic
Theres been a few posts on this board with people using the word "gay" or "faggot". Some say its "just a term" used with out any prejudices, while others get offended no matter what. My opinion is that using those are a "loaded gun". Meaning, they already have derogatory meaning around them when people use them in that fashion. Like saying..."that's ugly", some might say ..."that's gay". Does gay=ugly, bad, cheap,...etc.? What do you think about using those terms? We should learn and discuss everybodies opinion about this, no flames.



cosmic
ozorage
i've never said anything was "gay" ... i don't even use it to mean "happy" .... it bugs me when people say "gay" and mean "ugly,bad,cheap...etc" cuz "gay" has come to mean homosexual and not just "happy"...so first off happy does not mean "ugly,bad,cheap...etc" and secondly i wouldn't like it much if people said "oh that's salvadoran" and it meaning "oh that's...ugly,bad,cheap...ect"

ya dig?

wavenew.gif
zapatista
Today "gay" means homosexual. That is pretty much the universal meaning of the word in the society we live in. So when you use gay to say something is bad I think it equals homosexuality is bad. Besides there are like a million other adjectives you can use to say something sucks...why gay? The one most likely to offend.
Rage Man Leca
I agree with Zapatista, just say "this sucks" or that's stuipid.... why all this hate. I support Gay postive people and it really pisses me off when people use thoughs words. And then they say oh I didn't mean to use it... well next time you get in that situation, just don't say it.

Peace, love, Unity

Rage Man Leca
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Manifest
why dont we censor the entire Forum to be fucking PC furious.gif
cosmic
Manifest, its not about those words in this forum, its about their general use. I'm trying to figure out, like many, why people say it. ...its curiosity, plain and simple. What does censoring have to do about this?


cosmic
Manifest
can I be the censorship police ( I'll rat every homophobe out and we can kick them off the forum, than we can bitch about our first amendement rights being violated when it comes to speaking out about manners that are of intrest)
cosmic
What are you talking about? huh.gif



cosmic
Manifest
I'm refering to the fact that some people are hypocrites, they do all kinds of bitching about free speech and how they are all for it but when it comes down to something they do not support they turn around and contradict themselves by saying that it is not right to say something because it may offend someone, and I think thats complete shit.gif
cosmic
It is free speech and who's the hell is bitching? It's a discussion about a subject that we see all the time real life and in other message boards. Nobody's pointing fingers here, its about the subject matter. For the 2nd time, I really am interested in what people think about the usage of those terms, period. You're going off on a tangent.



By the way you're sounding, just because its free speech, its ok to say anything?

cosmic
Manifest
QUOTE
By the way you're sounding, just because its free speech, its ok to say anything?


In my opinion yes. I believe it is ok for anyone to say anything as long they are concious of the fact that have to accept responsilbilty for the comments they make, and that they should be prepared to recieve any backlash that comes their way because of 'em.

Example: you can talk shit about my mother, you got the freedom to, but you better be prepared to recieve an ass whoppin' for doing that.
cosmic
QUOTE (Manifest @ May 9 2003, 06:28 PM)
QUOTE
By the way you're sounding, just because its free speech, its ok to say anything?


In my opinion yes. I believe it is ok for anyone to say anything as long they are concious of the fact that have to accept responsilbilty for the comments they make, and that they should be prepared to recieve any backlash that comes their way because of 'em.

Example: you can talk shit about my mother, you got the freedom to, but you better be prepared to recieve an ass whoppin' for doing that.

I agree with you. You can state your opinion all day, and maybe get your ass kicked. The only thing I have to look out for people that post for the sole reason of writing infammatory personal remarks ( race, gender, religion,etc).


cosmic
Grey Mouse
I find the term, when used to describe something, really offensive. Whenever they use it to describe anything, to me, it's the equivalent of a guy saying to another guy "You drive like a girl". It's an insult towards someone and puts down another group of people. I've never taken it as someone saying gay=happy, that just doesnt make sense to me. mellow.gif Just my feelin
seditious beats
QUOTE
QUOTE (Manifest @ May 8 2003, 12:33 AM)
the way that the word "gay" is being used by us is not in a derogatory to way towards all homosexuals


Interesting orale.gif

QUOTE
This word is often used as slang to represent something that is not  cool and is in no way intended to disrespect the homosexual population everytime it is said.


Interesting orale.gif How's a gay person identified? "Gay"? So you see the problem? Nip it in the bud, compa'


rage baby
ya i'm tired of ppl using the word "gay" as an adjective.
RATM-EZLN
I agree with Manifest, i say what ever word i like to describe or refer what ever i feel like. Thats pretty much all i have to say.
Manifest
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Zero
I have a number of friends who are gay, and the term, 'gay', is pretty much the accepted term, though in some circles, 'queer' is no longer considered a term of abuse, either.

Z
Leylya
In our language gay is n't bad,we use it always,if we call someone gay it doesn't mean that we hate this person or gay.But i think that depends on context. In Russia homophobia isn't very wide-spread. Nazism and
religious discords are much more than homophobia.
mental_floss
I just think that it is important to be careful when using terms like “gay” as slang. When you think about the word gay you think of a person who is homosexual. So when you say that’s “gay”…well, you see the association. Big things start from small and if we use the term “gay” to say something is lame, then what’s next? “That’s _____” You fill in the blank with the slurs of your choice.
Sara
i dont think it's appropriate when ppl say "gay" to describe ugly or lame or cheap, i think it's stupid and childish.

to me saying something is gay to give it negative attributes is just as bad as making a racist or sexist remark.


it's like me saying "ew it's so hispanic" u know what i mean, to me it's very offensive. this is not bout freedom of speech it's bout watching out for other ppl's feelings, and having the decency to respect everyone around u.
Leylya
And how to call real gay?Without homophobia?If you want to know gays call themself gays too,i don't know how in another countries,but at my place they call. Churka or hachik for kavkazian, zhid for jew , red lace for comunist or uzkoglaziy for asian is much offensive than gay.
seditious beats
^it's not about how offensive it is, it's about just being offensive.
TheShootingStar
Man, I think this whole topic is just G.... j/k (don't have a cow.. lol)... But, for real though.. I agree with a lot of what Manifest was sayin.. A lot of people do contradict themselves when they say they are for free speech, but yet they are against stuff like this.. I also agree when he said if you say that kind of stuff, you should be willing to suffer the consequences.. ya know???

If I'm hanging around with a person that I know is gay or might be gay.. I wouldn't say nothin like that.. And thats just out of respect.. ya know????

But, at the same should I stop sayin and giving my opinion about stuff because I think it will offend people???? If thats the case I should just shut up about everything because it might offend someone.. ya know??


zapatista
^look, i'm all for free speech! Say what you will, it's all good. As Chomsky said "If we don't believe in freedom of speech for those we despise, we don't believe in it at all" I don't think anyone is saying that people can't use the word..no one is trying to censor here. I just think that Freedom of speech should be used for more important things then saying "oh, that's Gay". Just my thought though. If your going to use your freedom of speech say something important!

wavenew.gif

Zapatista
TheShootingStar
QUOTE (zapatista @ May 14 2003, 12:22 AM)
^look, i'm all for free speech! Say what you will, it's all good. As Chomsky said "If we don't believe in freedom of speech for those we despise, we don't believe in it at all" I don't think anyone is saying that people can't use the word..no one is trying to censor here. I just think that Freedom of speech should be used for more important things then saying "oh, that's Gay". Just my thought though. If your going to use your freedom of speech say something important!

wavenew.gif

Zapatista

"no one is trying to censor here." Please!!!!!! From what I have been reading it sounds like a lot of people are trying to get that little phrase censored out.. lol..
RATM-EZLN
QUOTE (zapatista @ May 13 2003, 04:22 PM)
If your going to use your freedom of speech say something important!

what if we have nothing important to say?? huh.gif we lose our freedom of speech, and gain it back when we have something important to say??... mellow.gif
zapatista
^hahaha I see your meaning. All I'm saying is WHY GAY? No one has been able to give a clear answer. I keep hearing freedom of speech...that's not clear enough for me. smile.gif
That's all i'm saying...dig? wink.gif
RATM-EZLN
QUOTE (zapatista @ May 13 2003, 05:07 PM)
^hahaha I see your meaning. All I'm saying is WHY GAY? No one has been able to give a clear answer. I keep hearing freedom of speech...that's not clear enough for me. smile.gif
That's all i'm saying...dig? wink.gif

maybve cuzz its shorter than homosexual? or..cuzz....i dunno...how does "thats straight" sound..?..i dunno..cuzz maybe the "normal" thing (even though i think normal is a stupid word) would be for some1 to be heterosexual..and being gay..not normal...there for... saying "thats gay" could mean..like "thats not normal", i dont know, its just a word.
cosmic
QUOTE (TheShootingStar @ May 13 2003, 05:48 PM)
QUOTE (zapatista @ May 14 2003, 12:22 AM)
^look, i'm all for free speech! Say what you will, it's all good. As Chomsky said "If we don't believe in freedom of speech for those we despise, we don't believe in it at all" I don't think anyone is saying that people can't use the word..no one is trying to censor here. I just think that Freedom of speech should be used for more important things then saying "oh, that's Gay". Just my thought though. If your going to use your freedom of speech say something important!

wavenew.gif

Zapatista

"no one is trying to censor here." Please!!!!!! From what I have been reading it sounds like a lot of people are trying to get that little phrase censored out.. lol..

If you're talking about the board, this has nothing to do with censoring nor will it ever be censored.


cosmic
Rage Man Leca
Good, ah cosmic you so cool!
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TheShootingStar
QUOTE (cosmic @ May 14 2003, 01:54 AM)
If you're talking about the board, this has nothing to do with censoring nor will it ever be censored.


cosmic

No, I'm talkin about what people have been sayin in their posts... I'm sayin it seems like people are trying to tell you what and what not to say..
cosmic
QUOTE (TheShootingStar @ May 13 2003, 08:52 PM)
QUOTE (cosmic @ May 14 2003, 01:54 AM)
If you're talking about the board, this has nothing to do with censoring nor will it ever be censored.


cosmic

No, I'm talkin about what people have been sayin in their posts... I'm sayin it seems like people are trying to tell you what and what not to say..

I don't think they're trying to tell people what too say, its just that this topic is so polar. Either its really inapproprate to say or it has no meaning, its just a word. Given that...I havent heard the reason as to why the word "gay" has to be used? That's what I don't get. Is there a root meaning?



cosmic
TheShootingStar
QUOTE (cosmic @ May 14 2003, 04:01 AM)
Either its really inapproprate to say or it has no meaning, its just a word. Given that...I havent heard the reason as to why the word "gay" has to be used? That's what I don't get. Is there a root meaning?



cosmic

Gay meaning.. Not cool...
seditious beats
QUOTE (RATM-EZLN @ May 14 2003, 01:47 AM)
maybve cuzz its shorter than homosexual? or..cuzz....i dunno...how does "thats straight" sound..?..i dunno..cuzz maybe the "normal" thing (even though i think normal is a stupid word) would be for some1 to be heterosexual..and being gay..not normal...there for... saying "thats gay" could mean..like "thats not normal", i dont know, its just a word.

read this to yourself again. she's not asking why the word is used to identify homosexuality, but why it's the chosen word to say something's not cool. no, it's not just a word. your name is not just a word by which you identify yourself with, seen?
Sara
^ exactly, it's not about using it to describe someone's sexuality like saying straight.


the topic is bout why use it to mean cheap or ugly, as in use it in a sense which in theory it doesn't represent.



so far, all u guys are saying is "freedom of speech" and "gay is not cool" what...? rolleyes.gif
Radisshu
er, i gotta confess i use the swedish word for 'gay' as an insult, but only towards those who dislike gay people.. cause they get mad. i have nothing against homosexuals.
Moremi
What I would like to know is, why do people get so bent out of shape when someone uses the word "gay" and no one says anything when someone uses the word "nigga" ????? The word "nigga" from my point of view is far more derogatory than the word "gay" which has meanings other than homosexuality.

When "nigga" was used on this board no one complained. No one started a thread about it. unsure.gif From what I remember, the only people who spoke up were myself and Sarah. A few other things that were clearly prejudice remarks about blacks have been made and again, not a peep. So, I guess it's ok to offend an entire group of people as long as it's not your group? Or a group you identify with? huh.gif

I agree with Manifest about the hypocrisy in this argument.

People will argue that nigga has a different meaning in hip hop culture, well so does gay. If one is acceptable here, why isn't the other?
seditious beats
QUOTE (ZDLRfan @ May 14 2003, 01:36 PM)
What I would like to know is, why do people get so bent out of shape when someone uses the word "gay" and no one says anything when someone uses the word "nigga" ?????






because we're talking about the word "gay" here.

QUOTE
The word "nigga" from my point of view is far more derogatory than the word "gay" which has meanings other than homosexuality.

it's not about which is more/less offensive.

QUOTE
When "nigga" was used on this board no one complained. No one started a thread about it. unsure.gif  

i'll speak for myself and say i didn't see it.

QUOTE
From what I remember, the only people who spoke up were myself and Sarah. A few other things that were clearly prejudice remarks about blacks have been made and again, not a peep.

again, i missed it, i don't read through the threads as thoroughly, i guess. and what's up with the "me and sarah" all the time?

QUOTE
So, I guess it's ok to offend an entire group of people as long as it's not your group? Or a group you identify with? huh.gif

i'm gay? news to me.

QUOTE
People will argue that nigga has a different meaning in hip hop culture, well so does gay. If one is acceptable here, why isn't the other?

has anybody argued about the meaning of "nigga" in hip hop culture here?

Moremi
QUOTE (seditious beats @ May 14 2003, 02:57 PM)
because we're talking about the word "gay" here.

Really? ohno.gif Thanks for pointing out the obvious. But other people have mentioned in their argument that saying "gay" is just as offensive as saying "how hispanic", etc. and the need to be sensitive towards a persons race, gender and sexual preference. So race was already injected in this discussion. I'm really not interested in trying to convince anyone why it's relevant that this is an issue and other inflamatory remarks have not been. It's relevant to me.

QUOTE
it's not about which is more/less offensive.

I never said it was about that. I just find it odd that I don't see this type of response to other words that are just as derogatory. I also find it odd that we have cartman.gif kenny.gif as emoticons yet we're criticisizing someone for using the word gay. Come on people, South Park? You just don't get any further from political correctness than that.

QUOTE
i'll speak for myself and say i didn't see it.

If you didn't see, then I'm not talking about you, am I?

QUOTE
again, i missed it, i don't read through the threads as thoroughly, i guess. and what's up with the "me and sarah" all the time?

What in god's name are you talking about? unsure.gif

QUOTE
i'm gay? news to me

I never said you or anyone else was gay. You don't have to be apart of a group to identify with its cause, struggle, etc.
Radisshu
...
well, if everyone were politically correct, where the fuck would humour be? seriously! as long as i don't say "KILL ALL GAY PEOPLE!(/black, white, asian, etc...)" a little joking doesn't hurt anyone, if the people of that particular "group" (although i say 'fuck groups', be an individual) can laugh as well... well, there'll always be more or less sensitive people, but screw them. or..er.. well, it's kind of impossible for me to be too sensitive, sorry =P... (maybe it's because of those damn old viking relatives or sumthin)
Mirylla
QUOTE (Radisshu @ May 14 2003, 10:18 PM)
...
well, if everyone were politically correct, where the fuck would humour be? seriously! as long as i don't say "KILL ALL GAY PEOPLE!(/black, white, asian, etc...)" a little joking doesn't hurt anyone, if the people of that particular "group" (although i say 'fuck groups', be an individual) can laugh as well... well, there'll always be more or less sensitive people, but screw them. or..er.. well, it's kind of impossible for me to be too sensitive, sorry =P... (maybe it's because of those damn old viking relatives or sumthin)

I noticed how you said "if the people of THAT particular "group" ", you didn't say ANY particular group, does it include your own group?
Anyway, those kind of jokes are usually funny when used by the same group or by friends. If not, they aren't generally welcome...
Another important thing besides free speech... RESPECT!!!


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Moremi
Those are all very good points M...very true wink.gif
seditious beats
we're dancing around the question that still has not been answered. why are these words being used? others say it, so one says it, too? i think that's it. responsibility, respect, etc... where do they come into play? maybe "freedom of speech" is used as an excuse for irresponsibility, negligence? "freedom" is misused.

ed did it: south park is a pretty intelligent show, believe it or not. there's always something thought-provoking to the said or insinuated. these kids grow up in the burbs, out of touch. when it's used for humor sometimes, it's to point out and make obvious a problem by exaggerating, but when the word is just used as another word in one's vocabulary, that's obviously not the same.
Moremi
QUOTE (seditious beats @ May 14 2003, 06:43 PM)
we're dancing around the question that still has not been answered.  why are these words being used?  others say it, so one says it, too?  i think that's it.  responsibility, respect, etc... where do they come into play?  maybe "freedom of speech" is used as an excuse for irresponsibility, negligence?  "freedom" is misused.

Well, I can't speak for everyone but I don't think it's always an excuse. Sometimes, it depends on the individual saying it. Sometimes, it has to do with the environment you come from. I choose not to use certain words but I'm not always offended when others use them because there is an understanding of what is being said.

QUOTE
ed did it: south park is a pretty intelligent show, believe it or not. there's always something thought-provoking to the said or insinuated. these kids grow up in the burbs, out of touch. when it's used for humor sometimes, it's to point out and make obvious a problem by exaggerating, but when the word is just used as another word in one's vocabulary, that's obviously not the same.


So says you. That show is full of stereotypes against gay people, blacks and the mentally disabled. It's offensive! And why is it acceptable to you when a character on South Park says "that is so gay" but here it's an insult?
seditious beats
QUOTE (ZDLRfan @ May 14 2003, 10:57 PM)
Well, I can't speak for everyone but I don't think it's always an excuse. Sometimes, it depends on the individual saying it. Sometimes, it has to do with the environment you come from. I choose not to use certain words but I'm not always offended when others use them because there is an understanding of what is being said.

of course it is not always an excuse, but in this case, i think we're educated enough here to know better. is that why you choose not to say certain words?

QUOTE

So says you. That show is full of stereotypes against gay people, blacks and the mentally disabled. It's offensive! And why is it acceptable to you when a character on South Park says "that is so gay" but here it's an insult?


the cartoon takes place in the burbs, the characters are kids not in the know of reality outside their li'l box town, like in real life, but exaggerated. it points this out, or no?
rev79
I don't believe there's anything wrong with using the word gay as an adjective. 'This movie is gay' or 'this song is gay', there's nothing wrong with that usage. But when you firmly start using that kind of term in the direction of an individual, then there is a problem I suppose. In this day and age we have multiple meanings for many words, which is why its acceptable, you just have to know when to use them.
Manifest
^ I totally agree with you, I guess it's different depending on your peer group becuase when im with certain people I can use that word freely, like with the cats I play ball with, we use that word freely and we dont intend to use it in reference to homosexuals
Sara
QUOTE (revolutionusa @ Jun 1 2003, 06:52 AM)
I don't believe there's anything wrong with using the word gay as an adjective. 'This movie is gay' or 'this song is gay', there's nothing wrong with that usage. But when you firmly start using that kind of term in the direction of an individual, then there is a problem I suppose. In this day and age we have multiple meanings for many words, which is why its acceptable, you just have to know when to use them.

but this is not about multiple meanings. we're not talking about gay meaning happy, or gay meanng homosexual. u say "this movie is gay" what do u actually mean?
rev79
Just uncool is all.
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