Abortion, thoughts Options

[Sara]

QUOTE (zapatista @ Apr 7 2003, 03:38 PM)

Ok, getting back to the subject, kind of. As far as China goes, they do have a serious over population there. Greater then I think we can appreciate. And cosmic made a good point about China taking extream measures, they have to take extream measures at this point. I can understand the need for a one child limit there, my problem is, that from things I have read. These ideals are being carried out in such a way that they are cruel and inhumane. Maybe Euthanasia? Any body have views on that?

i am against sterlisation, because bearing children is a woman's fundemental right.



also, the one child policy doesn't seem to be working very well in china, the socitey is patriarachal and patrilineal (correct me if im wrong) and so having boys is much better than having girls (at least most view this way). what happens when they give birth to a girl? well, some of them (not all, some) put the baby out with the garbage or on the streets.


so im fully against that crap.

[Radisshu]

... first they need to give women equal rights to men

[Manifest]

how so?

[Radisshu]

because then the chance of them dropping female babies in the streets, to get a male one instead, grows smaller.

(GROWS smaller? sounds odd.)

[Sara]

im not sure that's possible though.


it's a nice thought, but like, these values are part of their culture, and it has been for a very long time, it's hard to try and shift it or change it in such a short period of time.


i also would like to point out, that being a patriarchal patrilineal society doesn't make them misogynists. i think what triggered those incidents of putting baby girls in trash cans is really the one-child policy.

over all a family wants a boy, but never was pressured by limitations, till that Law was passed.

[Radisshu]

yeah, but now it's there to stay (the law thing)... hopefully women will get the same rights, in at least a while, so no babies will be put in the trash... i mean, then abortion's a LOT better

[Manifest]

did you know that it's a common thing to sell female children to whore houses and sweat shops

[Radisshu]

that sucks...
DAMN that's horrible!
ARRRGH!


...

hrm. that's why they need to make more equal..stuff.
and close all the brothels. =P

[comeandgetmeFEDS]

to be able to say that something (anything at all) doesn't have feeling just like you and I, is to say yourself that your feelings shouldn't have relevance to other peoples' actions. In a world where technology can identify the father, and rape cases, I think that we should treat it as a gift of truth. Meaning that in order to keep irresponsibility out of the abortion ring, rapes and incest should be the only cases in which an abortion be done. If someone knows that they won't be able to financially take care of another human, wear a god damn condom. If the condom breaks, go get the FREE shit at the pregnancy crisis center that will terminate the sperm fertilizing the egg....at any point where there is even a brain stem (which is sometime late in the first trimester) then it should be treated as so...something with the ability to produce thought, just like me or you...

[comeandgetmeFEDS]

about procreation and the persons right to choose whether or not they want to have kids are the fundamental principles of what philosophers have been trying to finger for all time...whether or not the will of all people is good or evil. Do you want to create more just because you can or do you want to yourself take responsibility in the actions of putting yet another potential threat to everyone here and not do it....no one knows if they are going to carry the next ghandi or hitler...most believe they will raise their kid to do what they think is right....but alot of people have a seemingly demented view of right and wrong...(i say seemingly because no one can possibly prove rightness or wrongness)



on that i say "perception is a misleading tool"

This post has been edited by comeandgetmeFEDS: Apr 25 2003, 10:36 PM

[Sara]

QUOTE (comeandgetmeFEDS @ Apr 26 2003, 07:20 PM)

to be able to say that something (anything at all) doesn't have feeling just like you and I, is to say yourself that your feelings shouldn't have relevance to other peoples' actions. In a world where technology can identify the father, and rape cases, I think that we should treat it as a gift of truth. Meaning that in order to keep irresponsibility out of the abortion ring, rapes and incest should be the only cases in which an abortion be done. If someone knows that they won't be able to financially take care of another human, wear a god damn condom. If the condom breaks, go get the FREE shit at the pregnancy crisis center that will terminate the sperm fertilizing the egg....at any point where there is even a brain stem (which is sometime late in the first trimester) then it should be treated as so...something with the ability to produce thought, just like me or you...

can u explain a bit more?


im not sure i fully get u, but r u saying that the only case where abortion should be permitted is when it's rape..?


a baby that is produced of rape or consensual sex is a baby...

if ur against abortion....it should apply to all babies

[The Wind below]

I personally have very strong feelings against abortion. My whole deal is that no one on this planet has the right to decide whether or not another person lives or dies other than the person themselves. That goes for everything, abortion, death penalty, euthenasia, all forms of accepted murder. My friend argued with me a while back that it is ok to abort a fetus because it is at the time nothing, it's an inaniment object, he compared it to a blade of grass. I said that the blade of grass doesn't have the potential to become a human being and that alone is reason enough to not abort a fetus. I don't know if that is the universal argument for all pro choice people out there, but he did a good job of making it seem like it is. No body, no one at all can say that a baby/fetus should be aborted, not even the mother that has it. That is not her decision, it is not her life, it is that baby's life. I agree that back alley abortions would not be good and would happen, but I think abortion is arrogant and barbaric in our modern society where we are "civil".

[cosmic]

Wind Below, does this apply to anything living or just humans?


cosmic

[The Wind below]

for me it's just humans, I'm not a vegetarian. But, thats not a universal code, so it can apply to animals, it doesn't for me.

[annakist]

QUOTE (kawaii_buttercup @ Mar 29 2003, 12:08 AM)

NO partial birth abortions. That's just SICK! The baby will feel his/her life being sucked out in such a brutal way...... I myself am pro-choice....to a certain degree. I agree that abortions should only be performed in dire situations, when the mother's life is in danger, rape or incest....what good will it be when your child grows up and wonders who's his/her father? That would be quite psychologically damaging if you tell them that their daddy's a rapist!!!

I couldnt agree more......partial birth i havent even heard of it ...thats awful!!!!!...........my feelings are that there are many unwanted unloved children in this world ....too many of them and in many cases this is a result of carelessness on the part of the people who had unprotected sex in the first place, however not all people who find themselves pregnant are careless.........and we all can make mistakes.....if this happens and someone feels they are not ready or dont want children they should terminate the pregnancy as soon as possible.......we should have this freedom and right........and it shouldnt be judged negitively in this case. Abortion is extremely difficult for many people - physically, emotionally and mentally.......if done out of the care of the future of our race and our children it should be accepted ...........i think its religion (of various kinds) that has mainly attached this stigma to abortion....